Jairam Ramesh says India isn't waiting for aid from richer nations before acting on climate change
NEW DELHI (AlertNet) - Before heading to the U.N. climate talks now underway in Cancun, Mexico, India's environment minister and chief climate change negotiator Jairam Ramesh spoke to AlertNet correspondent Nilanjana Bhowmick.
He said that, despite frustrations with the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, the world should stick with it as the only legally binding initiative on global warming. Ramesh also outlined India's approach of adopting a more assertive approach to the negotiations, which are struggling to move forward due to disagreements between rich and poor nations.
As India is now the world's third largest emitter of greenhouse gases, do you foresee the pressure shifting from China to India any time soon?
There is no danger of India overtaking China on emissions. The United States and China are the big two. India is not in that league. India's emissions are one quarter of (those of) the United States and China.
Is there a conflict within India's climate negotiating team between old-style people and new reformers?
I wouldn't call it a conflict, but rather that there are different perceptions. One perception is that India shouldn't do anything till it gets money and technology from abroad. Another perception is that we shouldn't do anything till the others do something. I have taken a slightly more nuanced and pragmatic approach.
I have not linked what we do with support and finance and technology from abroad. My position has been that we should do things unilaterally. We speak from a position of leadership. We shouldn't be lecturing others. We should be demonstrating our commitment by example.
We must have strong, aggressive domestic action dictating our negotiating position. We must take the leadership in negotiations. The Prime Minister has always said to me, be part of the solution through creativity and innovation. And that's what we have tried to be without abdicating our basic principles – without taking absolute cuts or agreeing to all the demands Western countries are making. It is in our interest to do so.
You assumed office in 2009. Since then you have not only raised the profile of what was seen to be a low-key ministry, but under your guidance India has also taken a more assertive international role on the environment...
I am doing nothing new. If you look back in history, the heyday of environment and development in India was during former Prime Minister Indira Gandhi's time. She was an extraordinarily tough leader who balanced the imperatives of growth with her environmental concerns. She stopped the silent valley project in Kerala in the early 80s to preserve one of India's precious rainforest areas.
Today, every prime minister and every president wants to get on the environmental bandwagon, but in 1972 there were only two heads of state who attended the first U.N. conference on the Human Environment – one was the host Prime Minister Olof Palme and the other was Indira Gandhi.
Ecology is deeply embedded in our culture. We worship our animals, mountains and rivers. There is no other civilisation in the world that is so much embedded in ecology and nature as India. And therefore it is something that should be natural to us and we should be the leaders in protecting it. The patron saint of modern environmentalism is Mahatma Gandhi. India owes it to these legendary figures to take these commitments very seriously.
How important is regional cooperation in combating combating climate change?
South Asia is a very vulnerable region as far as climate change is concerned, and India stands prepared to lend assistance for adaptation to climate change to countries in the region. We are trying to collaborate with regional programmes in glaciology with China, Nepal, Bhutan and Pakistan. We are committed.
India has given $1 million each to the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation (SAARC) Coastal Zone Management Centre in the Maldives and the SAARC Forestry Centre in Thimpu. Along with the joint Sunderbans Eco-System Forum between India and Bangladesh, we have also recently signed the SAARC convention on the environment.
Given that India is looking to switch to low-carbon growth, why are there still large subsidies on petrol, which drive continuing fossil fuel use and make it harder for renewable energy options to compete?
We are progressively phasing them out, there is no question about it. The fuel subsidies particularly do not reach the poor for whom they are intended. Thirty to forty percent of kerosene gets into the black market.
And certainly you don't want to subsidise diesel cars. It's criminal to have diesel-run cars today – luxury cars like BMWs, SUVs - and that's directly because of the pricing policy we have.
For many years I have been saying that fuel subsidies do not make much sense. We must have a market-determined system ... Kerosene and cooking gas will still be subsidised but they are cross-subsidised. I think we are moving towards a regime of a more rational fuel pricing policy.
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